Weetbix wrote:

That adds nothing to the question of whether they are robust enough

We played Gailes yesterday and a member at Jindalee had a lower cap there than at his home course – but those who have played both tell me that Jindalee is an easier not harder course

So I remain doubtful about the quality of the ratings

I’m inclined to agree re the robust-ness of ratings. I use my current versus previous course as a good example.

Frog – Slope 136, ACR 73, Par 72. YM…the minimum is the Valley layout, holes 10-27, Slope 134, ACR 72, Par 72.

Not only are all of the layouts at Yering more difficult (in my opinion) than the Frog (Nursery 136, 72, 72, Homestead 139, 72, 72), mainly due to the amount of water on probably all bar half a dozen of the 27 holes, but the course rating of 73 at the Frog is a bonus compared to the ridiculously low (by comparison) 72 at YM.

My handicap at YM is the same as when I left the Frog. After jumping about 3 shots at one point. I can tell you right now – I have to play a hell of a lot better to shoot 36 at YM than I do to do the same at the Frog.

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Madam, Weetbix

For individual club comps it doesn’t matter how they compare to other clubs, but I am equally suspicious of the 1 or 2 shot differences between tees at an individual club

I have no actual data, just a sense that forward tees are a bit easier relative to back tees compared to the 1 or 2 shots you get on your playing cap

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Hack2489

For me…black tees at Yering means at least 2 clubs difference in either the 2nd shot, or the approach shot – which could be the 4th shot – on every hole. To me, that means about 6 holes that I can potentially reach in reg become unreachable without an extra shot.

@weetbix has identified the core issue. i.e. the “robustness” of the ratings of tees on the same course.

I feel that both slope and scratch rating need to be checked for all tees her in Australia before competition rounds are played from different tees in the same comp.

I also like the idea from @deege of medal rounds or club champs being played across all tees on the course. That would mix up the rounds, make players think a bit more and add another element to the outcome. All players play off back markers, then say forward tees, then say usual comp tees etc. With mixed pin positions, the player ability to adjust best to course conditions would be a good element for the outcome.

A forward tee on a par 3 with a pin tucked up behind a front bunker vs it playing as a long par 3 with pin back centre of green? Same course, very different shot and mindset needed.

I’d still probably hit it fat and have to chip on regardless.

• This reply was modified 4 years, 11 months ago by Hack2489.

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Commish, Madam

Madam wrote:

xrman wrote:

I played at Barnbougle last year and was surprised to find that they had 4 tee positions that were allocated to you on the basis of handicap. The lower your handicap, the further back you tee off from. As a 20 + handicapper then I thought it was a good idea until I found that now my drives were now in putting me in range of the fairway bunkers. I had a good game and enjoyed the experience, thinking that this must be what it feels to be a good golfer who can hit 250 m plus drives and then hit high lofted clubs into greens.

Most clubs I play at have Mens, Ladies and green fee paying golfer tees. I was talking with Bogey Golfer last week and he mentioned that his club is going to trial the tee positions according to handicap. I wondered what the pros and cons would be.

Just to see what it was like laying off the front ( red) tees at our club I played a practice game today using the red tees. What I found was on some holes it didn’t make a lot of difference, but on others there were advantages. The dog leg holes where I could not hit over the bend reliably, I had to use shorter clubs than usual to get to the bend. The straighter holes I ended up hitting to the green with higher lofted clubs and reduced my score.

One downside I thought of is that the pace of play might be adversely affected, while players mover out of the way of the back markers while they drive, then move into position for their turn. It might also skew results in favour of higher handicap players for a while, as they can score better being in range with scoring clubs a little sooner. Their handicap would drop fairly quickly and then they would be relegated to the next tee position ( towards the rear).

The upside I think would be to increase the enjoyment of the game by those players who have either lost distance as they aged, or never had it in the first place. Also leaners might be more encouraged to join in competitions earlier, if they saw a handicap system helping them on the course, as well as in the scoring system.

What do you think?

• This topic was modified 4 years, 11 months ago by xrman.

Gender-neutral tees are the go and its why we have a slope rating system in place (theoretically).

Let people play (male/female) from whichever tee and adjust handicap accordingly. Play the tee for your handicap level and enjoy the round.

Suggestion
Given you are in favour of this approach why not adopt this multi tee approach to the Nationals competition this year A.
great opportunity to bring some innovation into the event, rather than everyone getting beaten up with long water carries.
the courses we are playing have multi tees in place so lets use them

here’s a suggestion All play of mid tees (white) for round 1, then allocate tees for Sunday based on Saturday scores.
eg 36 points and above move back to blue tees,
30 to 36 stay off mid tees.
less than 30 play one tee forward red.
really even out the competition and make the game much more enjoyable.

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Madam

Yeah.

Nah.

Hack2489 wrote:

@weetbix has identified the core issue. i.e. the “robustness” of the ratings of tees on the same course.

I feel that both slope and scratch rating need to be checked for all tees her in Australia before competition rounds are played from different tees in the same comp.

I also like the idea from @deege of medal rounds or club champs being played across all tees on the course. That would mix up the rounds, make players think a bit more and add another element to the outcome. All players play off back markers, then say forward tees, then say usual comp tees etc. With mixed pin positions, the player ability to adjust best to course conditions would be a good element for the outcome.

A forward tee on a par 3 with a pin tucked up behind a front bunker vs it playing as a long par 3 with pin back centre of green? Same course, very different shot and mindset needed.

I’d still probably hit it fat and have to chip on regardless.

• This reply was modified 4 years, 11 months ago by Hack2489.

We’ll see if event is happening first- then the committee can review.

We tend to go with middle tees usually, based on course slope rating etc. The Qld version we did Blue but rain condition made it so much longer and tougher

PS I thought the handicapping was done with red wine at the dinner and the early start!